Get Involved - Parliament

Early Childhood Education

Published on: March 2020

Record: HANSARD-1323879322-110001

Early Childhood Education

Mr JAMES GRIFFIN (Manly) (16:57):

:03 I move:

That this House:

(1) Notes the Government's commitment to making before- and after-school care available to all parents with children at public primary schools by 2021, supported by an investment of $120 million over four years.

(2) Notes that since 1 July 2019 more than 7,500 before- and after-school care places have been created across New South Wales.

(3) Notes that the Government has allocated almost $527 million for early childhood education, which includes extending funding to all three‑year‑olds and four‑year‑olds in community preschools—the first Australian State to do so.

I am pleased to move the motion. I recognise the significant work undertaken by the New South Wales Coalition Government in supporting our young people and their families from day one. Whether it is the record investment by this Government in our hospitals and schools or in major infrastructure projects across New South Wales, the Government is delivering for communities in every corner of our State. The New South Wales Government is focused on providing access to quality and affordable out-of-school care for families of all children attending government primary schools. The Government is rapidly progressing on its $120 million election commitment to expand access to before‑ and after‑school care across New South Wales for public primary schoolchildren. That is a significant investment and represents the values that the Government holds: supporting families and delivering for our young people, no matter their stage of life.

Since July 2019 more than 7,500 before‑ and after‑school-care places have been delivered in New South Wales. That is great news for families and represents a commitment by government to work alongside schools and communities to deliver much‑needed spaces. Since July 2019 we have grown the before‑ and after‑school‑care sector by 68 more services, with seven schools in the focus areas of Sydney, Newcastle, the Illawarra and the Central Coast. In addition, major regional centres have new onsite services. By term one 2021 we will have created 120 new services statewide, including 44 new onsite services in metropolitan and inner regional schools, with enrolments above 160 students. Overall, that will create up to 19,000 new places across the State—an incredible achievement by the Government.

Included in the $120 million package is a commitment by the Government to deliver $50 million for before‑ and after‑school-care infrastructure to expand facilities for the creation of places; $20 million for smaller communities in New South Wales to pilot new approaches where a standalone approach may not be viable; $40 million in rental subsidies to be made available to services at public primary schools; $8 million for teams of proactive specialists to help coordinate services and resources across different areas of New South Wales by providing on‑the‑ground assistance with set‑up, contract management and service transition; and, finally, $2 million to create new online support tools for parents.

For the benefit of members opposite, Service NSW is playing a vital role in the rollout of the program. Many parents use Service NSW to find available before‑ and after‑school-care services near them. They can place expressions of need when no services are available. Whether it is through bushfire relief or before‑ and after‑school care, Service NSW has become an invaluable tool for the families of New South Wales. I recognise and commend the good work of the Minister for Customer Service, Minister Dominello, and his team. The New South Wales Government is delivering world‑class early childhood education, anchored by extension of funding to all three‑year‑olds and four‑year‑olds in community preschools. I am proud that New South Wales is the first Australian State to do so.

The Government remains committed to universal access to two years participation in preschool for a minimum of 600 hours. We have allocated $20 million over the next four years in addition to the $42.1 million announced in the 2018‑19 budget for new or existing community preschools to either build, improve or extend facilities to cater for increasing enrolments, wherever they may be across New South Wales. I recognise the Minister for Education and Early Childhood Learning in the other place for delivering the investment for the betterment of all New South Wales communities. Since 2018 over 1,200 grants have been awarded under the Quality Learning Environments grants program, totalling more than $13 million. I can attest to the positive impact of grants allocated to preschools in my electorate of Manly.

The grants program supports the delivery of quality early childhood education by recognising that to support the educational needs of our young people their preschools' physical environment is key. The program supports preschools to enhance their premises by addressing identified safety, health or other functional needs. We have some great preschools in Manly. I recognise the Northern Beaches Council, which operates numerous community preschools on the peninsula, many of which have been recipients of a Quality Learning Environments grant. The importance placed on early childhood education by this Government can be seen in my community.

Investments include $10,000 to Harbord Kindergarten in Freshwater for its playground upgrade; $10,000 to Manly Vale Community Kindergarten for a new cubby house and additional works, which I was proud to open in August last year—I did not go inside the cubby house; over $9,000 to St James Kindergarten in Balgowlah Heights for upgrades to its outdoor play area and water play wall; almost $10,000 to Manly Community Preschool, operated by Northern Beaches Council, for gardening at the preschool; and $10,000 to North Harbour Children's Centre in Balgowlah, also operated by the council, for sustainability workshops. Those grants made in my electorate exemplify the Government's commitment to directing funding where it needs to go. From Manly to Mudgee and anywhere that needs support across New South Wales, this Government is delivering for our young people and their families by investing in quality learning environments in our preschools and supporting universal access for all three‑year‑olds and four‑year‑olds in community preschools. I commend the motion to the House.

Ms JODIE HARRISON (Charlestown) (17:03):

:25 I move:

That the motion be amended by adding:

(4)Notes the Government's appalling history in not achieving its early childhood promises over the past nine years.

(5)Calls upon the Government to stop lagging behind the rest of Australia and provide the universal early education that our children deserve.

I move this amendment because, as with everything this Government has anything to do with, it knows how to talk the talk but it does not know how to walk the walk. This motion is shameless backslapping. Last year we were told that $120 million would be spent providing before- and after-school-care places for every child in a public primary school by 2021. The member for Manly said that this was for all children in public primary schools. There are 491,000 children in our public primary schools. In total, even with the places created, only 105,000 are places for outside-school-hours care. There are nine months until the Government's own deadline for promised universal access and we have only one outside-school-hours-care place for every five children in a public primary school. One in five is hardly universal access. But we are used to this. The Government has form on being big on headlines and small on action. In 2018 there was the promise of $200 million to get every three‑ and four‑year‑old child into two years of preschool education before they start school.

Ms Kate Washington:

I remember that.

Ms JODIE HARRISON:

Absolutely. The member for Port Stephens would remember. Now the Government has backtracked and said, "Whoops! We meant to say community preschools." Even if we look at community preschools, which provide only a fraction of preschool programs in New South Wales, when that policy was announced there were 28,740 places in community preschools. Universal access was announced and big spending was shouted about but where were we 18 months later, at the end of last year? We had a reduction of 1,000 places just in community preschools. There are fewer preschool places for our kids; that is what this Government wants to celebrate this afternoon. Every parent is getting used to what this Government means when it talks about universal access.

But there is something much more serious at stake here. This morning in budget estimates the Minister for Education and Early Childhood Learning assured the committee that her chief commitment and highest priority was safety in our early learning services. After all, the Minister is responsible for the licensing and regulation of early childhood services in New South Wales—her own department does this. But she forgot to tell the committee that the number of unannounced spot checks at services are going down, not up; the number of serious incidents—children being locked in or being taken from services and being unaccounted for—is up, not down; and serious incidents in proportion to the total number of services is disproportionately up in New South Wales when compared with the rest of Australia.

Report on Government Services

Why might this be happening? Here are some disturbing figures. Currently, 373 early childhood learning services in New South Wales have been approved but have had no external quality assessment by the regulator, the Government, which lets them operate. Those 373 services have places for over 24,000 children, and many of them have been operating for more than two years without any formal assessment of their quality. What has the Government done in response to back up its big talk on quality and safety? It has budgeted to spend nearly $1 million on a new sticker to show the quality rating that a service has received. No wonder early learning providers are up in arms about this Government. It is not investing in quality, it is not making good on the promised new places, but it is signing a $70,000 contract with The Wiggles so that the Minister for Education and Early Childhood Learning can be photographed with Dorothy the Dinosaur and her new sticker. The latest says that New South Wales is lagging behind the rest of Australia.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! Members will come to order.

Ms JODIE HARRISON:

We have the lowest participation rates in early education programs, the highest costs to families in the country and the worst safety record for our young children. This Government should be ashamed of itself.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

The member for Terrigal will resume his seat.

Ms FELICITY WILSON (North Shore) (17:08):

:48 I support the motion moved by my esteemed colleague the member for Manly. He and I share many things in common, including a very personal interest in early childhood care, given that we both have children who are just over one year old. We are incredibly reliant on our communities and services to make sure that we can invest in the future of our children. All members in this place are committed to providing the investment that all children need across our community to have the best start in life. We know that early childhood learning and education is vital to ensure that our kids get the best start in life, and education is one of the reasons that I came to this place. The Berejiklian Government has made historic increases in funding provided per child in community preschools across New South Wales.

In the 2019-20 budget $526.7 million was allocated to early childhood learning, including the Start Strong program to support preschool education in community preschools and long day care centres across New South Wales. This Government is also committed to improving access for disadvantaged and vulnerable children. It has provided $16 million over two years for the Strong Start Pathways program, which targets the early learning needs of disadvantaged and vulnerable children who are too young for preschool and supports pathways into early childhood education. The Government has also continued funding to enhance participation and educational outcomes in early childhood education for children with a disability. We know that our kids thrive in the right environment, so ensuring that each early childhood centre and preschool can create the right environment is vital.

Through the Government's Quality Learning Environments program we have been able to support a number of early childhood education services to improve their learning environments and positively impact experiences and outcomes for preschool-age children. In my electorate of North Shore, a number of early childhood education services have received funding through the Quality Learning Environments program. Goodstart Early Learning in North Sydney received $7,763 for the purchase of outdoor equipment and the development of an art corner; Uniting Shirley Road Preschool received $8,946 for Aboriginal cultural incursion and yoga classes; Goodstart Early Learning in Mosman received $7,349 for outdoor play equipment; Goodstart Early Learning in St Leonards received $5,714 for the purchase of a playhouse and outdoor equipment; and St Johns Child Care Centre, which is just across the road from my electorate office, received $9,073 for the purchase of new outdoor equipment.

The parents had a big working bee to put that equipment together. They have a wonderful outdoor space with lots of risky play for children to try and make sure they give them the learning environment they need to have the development they deserve. At the end of last year I visited the centre across the road to talk to the staff about how programs like these are making a positive impact on the centre and the kids. Not only do the kids benefit from using new and improved outdoor equipment by getting outside and being physical, but also they see their parents involved in the school community through the day care centre. The kids were very proud to play on the equipment that their mums and dads worked on. Members on this side of the House know that juggling a family and work can be very difficult. In my electorate there is a significant number of families where both parents work. They rely heavily on early childhood care and also before- and after-school-care services to assist in their day-to-day lives.

Before- and after-school-care services operate in about 720 public schools in New South Wales. They provide before- and after-school-hours care as well as onsite holiday care for students at the school and other eligible children. At the 2019 State election we committed $120 million to expand access to before- and after‑school care for public primary schoolchildren across the State. This Government initiative aims to fill gaps in access to services across the State and to clear waiting lists in areas of high demand. The commitment includes: $50 million in infrastructure funding to expand facilities and create new places, $20 million for smaller communities to pilot new approaches where a standalone approach may not be viable, $40 million in rental subsidies to be made available to services at public primary schools, $8 million for a team of specialists to help coordinate services and resources and $2 million to create new online support tools for parents.

This is a government that listens, which is why we have made such a significant investment in before‑ and after-school care. I know that many parents and families in my electorate rely on those services as they try to balance work and family life. I have spent quite a bit of time with Mosman Public School and the Department of Education on work investing in a new building for before- and after-school care. We have heard from over 6,000 parents in our survey. We are working hard to ensure that we continue to deliver for our communities by providing the services that many rely on.

Ms ANNA WATSON (Shellharbour) (17:13):

:51 Members opposite have no credibility whatsoever when it comes to education at any level—whether it be early childhood learning, primary school, high school or TAFE. The Government's form over the past 11 years shows exactly how it feels about education and public education in this State. They have no credibility to get up here and debate this at all. It is shameful. I am going to start with a little story from my electorate; it was those opposite who actually closed down early learning centres in public schools. It is sickening for the Opposition in New South Wales to have to sit and listen to the diatribe that comes out of Government members' mouths. Imagine how sickening it is for parents whose services are being cut and whose kids cannot even attend any of these services.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! I cannot hear the member for Shellharbour.

Ms ANNA WATSON:

It is an absolute disgrace that those opposite can come in here—

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

I call the member for Terrigal to order for the first time.

Ms ANNA WATSON:

—and open their mouths and think that they have any credibility in this space at all. I know that the member for Kiama does not really care about this issue because—

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

I call the member for Kiama to order for the first time.

Mr Gareth Ward:

You have just been rubbishing and dribbling on.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

I call the member for Kiama to order for the second time.

Ms ANNA WATSON:

At the end of the day you just have to ignore him because he cannot help himself.

Mr Gareth Ward:

You cannot help yourself.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! I direct the member for Kiama to remove himself from the Chamber for 10 minutes.

Pursuant to sessional order the member for Kiama left the Chamber at 5.18 p.m.

[]

Ms ANNA WATSON:

Excellent. See you later. Assistant Speaker, thank you for that. That is an excellent call. We know that every person caring for a young person in New South Wales is already struggling to make ends meet due to the broken promises and systemic mismanagement of the early childhood sector by those opposite. The amendments provided by my colleague the shadow Minister for Early Childhood Learning get to the root of what we should be discussing today. I congratulate her on that.

Those opposite have an appalling track record with the early childhood sector and we all know that. It is our State's families and our State's children who are suffering the most. This Government spends drastically less per child on early childhood services than any other State in Australia. I will give members the statistics on that because they are very interesting. In 2017 the New South Wales Government spent an average of $246 per child on early childhood services. Western Australia spent an average of $733 per child. South Australia spent an average of $704 per child. The Australian Capital Territory, a territory of New South Wales, spent $628 per child, which is more than double what New South Wales has spent. Those opposite should not stand in this place and lecture us on what a great job they are doing in this space. I would be very embarrassed if I were any of them.

Our State has the lowest proportion of children enrolled in preschool participation in the year before full‑time school. In 2017 only 71 per cent of our State's kids were enrolled in preschool before attending full‑time school. Australia-wide, governments have been given a goal to see 95 per cent of their children enrolled. Those opposite are failing miserably and they know it. New South Wales is lagging behind every other State—and that is an understatement. We are also paying one of the highest hourly rates for child care in Australia. Those most vulnerable and people who really need to access the services do not have the means to do so.

Right now people in our State are paying more than anyone and getting less out of their government. Why should they believe a thing that comes out of the mouths of any of those on that side of the House? People have stopped listening. They do not trust the Government on TAFE. They do not trust the Government on early childhood education. They do not trust the Government on primary school education. In the 2015 election it was a Labor Government that committed $45 million to build a school precinct in West Dapto. In 2019 we committed $60 million for a school precinct in West Dapto. What did those opposite commit? Nothing. Ten years later they have not even bought the block of land.

Time expired.

In January this year data revealed that parents in New South Wales are paying more than $15,000 a year for child care. Since this Liberal-Nationals Government came to power hourly fees at our State's childcare centres have grown by 34 per cent. Those astronomical costs are coupled with the ballooning costs of living. I could go on and give members the statistics, but what makes me most sick is how those opposite sit there and say, "We are just so proud of what we've done in this State." How proud are they about those statistics on early childhood care? How proud are they about parents having to pay $15,000 more a year than parents in any other State in this country? There is nothing to be proud of—nothing whatsoever. While taxpayer-funded subsidies mean that families are not shouldered with the full cost of child care, that does not mean we should not do everything we can to reduce the costs. []

Mr MICHAEL JOHNSEN (Upper Hunter) (17:19):

:04 I speak in support of this motion and in doing so I speak as a parent, a grandfather and the father of a teacher.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! If the member for Wollongong wants to join the member for Kiama, I can make that happen.

Mr MICHAEL JOHNSEN:

While those opposite wallow in their own self-induced misery I will talk about some positive news. I am proud to serve in a government that is delivering for young people and their families across New South Wales. It is a matter of understandable pride for those of us on the Treasury benches that the Government has made a commitment to making before- and after-school care available to all parents with children at public primary schools by the year 2021, which is supported by an investment of $120 million over four years. The Government's $120 million commitment includes $50 million for new facilities and equipment; $40 million in rental subsidies; $20 million for innovative solutions to meet the needs of smaller schools, particularly those in our rural and remote communities; $8 million to create a specialist team to support principals in administering these vital services; and $2 million to create new online support tools for parents.

The commitment aims to deliver to places where there is student need in our communities. We know that it can sometimes be a challenge to get enough enrolments in rural, regional and smaller schools to make a service a viable operation. That is usually why those services do not exist already. This is the reason the commitment includes funding targeted directly at our rural, regional and smaller schools, and the team is co-designing approaches with stakeholders from those areas. Every community is different and the plan includes pilot programs for transport to other sites and a range of other measures to ensure services are sustainable.

We take pride in the fact that since 1 July 2019 more than 7,500 before- and after-school-care places have been created across New South Wales. It is the first State in our Commonwealth to extend funding to all three-year-olds and four-year-olds in community preschools. Those are the hallmarks of a government that places great importance on responsible economic management and all of the benefits that flow from that. I have seen this firsthand in my electorate of Upper Hunter, where preschools and young families have benefited from government grants and programs that have made our preschool sector the envy of Australia.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

I call the member for Port Stephens to order for the first time.

Mr MICHAEL JOHNSEN:

Thanks to the New South Wales Government's Quality Learning Environments program the Upper Hunter electorate has benefited from $102,661 in funding grants. Those grants can be used to make physical improvements to early childhood services such as new gardens, jungle gyms or bathroom renovations and can also assist the rollout of new learning programs such as music lessons or yoga classes. The New South Wales Government's preschool drought relief program is another example of this Government delivering for not just young families but also those communities in rural and regional New South Wales that are affected by drought. This additional drought relief funding for childcare centres can be used to reduce fees and to implement transport initiatives, staff training and environmental adjustments.

In the Upper Hunter electorate this funding has amounted to $251,575 across 31 local providers. This funding helps to ensure that early childhood services in our region continue to operate despite the potential challenges brought on by drought. Further to this was the recent announcement that preschools in bushfire‑impacted areas will benefit from a one-off payment to provide fee relief and to help with the recovery from this summer's devastating fires. In the Upper Hunter electorate five local preschools benefited from this funding. They are Gloucester Pre-School, Singleton Mobile Preschool, Singleton Heights Pre-School, Singleton Pre‑School and Stroud Neighbourhood Children's Co-operative. The payments are another way the Liberal‑Nationals Government is supporting bushfire communities to get back on their feet.

Time expired.

Two preschools in Upper Hunter successfully applied for the New South Wales Government's successful capital works grants program. In 2017 the $10 million Start Strong Capital Works grants program resulted in Singleton Heights Pre-School receiving $330,000. In 2018 the $5 million Start Strong Capital Works grants program saw Paterson Pre-School receive $790,000. They say that actions speak louder than words. This Government's commitment to before- and after-school care speaks for itself not just in Upper Hunter but across New South Wales. We have a proud record and it will only get better. []

Ms SONIA HORNERY (Wallsend) (17:24):

:14 I welcome the opportunity to debate the motion on early childhood learning in this House today. I note that in the past eight years of the conservative Government this is the first opportunity that I or this House has had to have a serious discussion about early childhood education. It has been eight long years. I want to capture a couple of the points made by the member for Charlestown and the member for Upper Hunter. I agree that provision of early childhood learning services should be based very much on addressing the need of areas. I will draw on a couple of my experiences as a teacher in Walgett and conversations I had with early childhood teachers way back in the late 1980s. The member for Wyong, as a former primary school teacher and principal, would have some experiences to relate if he were speaking about this too.

Capturing one of the points made by the member for Charlestown, the first question I ask the Government is: Why is the number of new places so very small and nowhere near universal across the State? Why do we have the lowest participation rates in Australia? But I would like to focus on workplace issues that the Government must address. The early learning sector is facing a workforce crisis. We need to know what the Government is doing and what its initiatives are to encourage workforce growth—where are they? Why are degree-trained early learning teachers leaving for the primary sector? Is it because their pay rates and conditions are better in the primary sector than they are in the early childhood sector? Early childhood is the time when all of a person's foundational knowledge is made, particularly up to the age of three.

For example, one of the four areas in the NSW Early Childhood Education Workforce Strategy is to support the workforce to obtain qualifications and experience to prepare them for the workplace. As part of the strategy the Government announced a $1.3million four-year program of scholarships commencing in 2016 to train 120 teachers for early learning in rural and remote areas. It is four years on and only $375,000 has been distributed and only eight students have qualified. That is only 6 per cent of the promised 120 teachers. Workers are leaving the sector in droves—they really are. We looked also at the experiences of Victoria and Queensland. Perhaps we need to look at some of the things they are doing.

Before I continue I will give a few examples from the late 1980s when I was first teaching at Walgett. I had some conversations with some infants teachers at Walgett Public School. We had spent some time at Brewarrina, Goodooga, Burren Junction and Collarenebri. They were all the schools that the Teachers Federation used to go around to in those areas even more isolated than Walgett. We would have barbecues and just check that they were all okay. The problems the infants teachers talked to me about in the 1980s have not gotten any better. They talked about the fact that the students were not school ready.

In Walgett most of the children grew up on a mission reserve, unemployment was extremely high and living conditions were very poor. The children turned up at school without knowing how to brush their teeth or how to hold a pencil. Their parents did not have any books because they could not afford them so they had no reading experience. Compare that to some of the students mentioned today from some of the better, richer areas. Unfortunately I recognise that it has not got any better for those kids who live at the Gingie mission or the Namoi reserve in Walgett. They are still getting to school not ready. I ask the Government: What are we really doing about those kids with the greatest needs? How is the Government changing the lives of those children for the better?

Ms JENNY LEONG (Newtown) (17:29):

:19 On behalf of The Greens I make a contribution to this public interest debate. The subject of this debate, early learning and before- and after-school care, is certainly in the public interest. The Government's pre-election promise was to provide before- and after-school care at every primary school in Sydney and major regional centres. In practice this promise has developed into the privatisation of many before- and after-school-care services and unacceptable increases in fees to not-for-profits as well as lowering the standards of care in some instances. There is huge demand for affordable before- and after-school care in New South Wales, with over 150,000 primary school students requiring this care.

Early learning itself is crucial and invaluable in addressing inequality and disadvantage in our society. Privatising this essential part of our education system is unacceptable. It is unacceptable that we are outsourcing our children's education and learning to private, for-profit providers, which is cause for serious concern. We are entrenching inequality in our future society if the main way people access early childhood education and learning is through paid services with for-profit providers. Recent reports have shown that Australian families are spending up to $6.8 billion on child care and early learning costs every year, including an average of $6,000 on long day care.

We have to start building a society where child care is an essential service, and early childhood education and learning is universally available and freely accessible to every family that needs it. That is what The Greens want to see, that is what the community wants to see, and that is what our children need and deserve. Instead, in New South Wales the Government's solution has been to seek to radically alter before- and after-school care by opening it up to for-profit companies and providing large subsidies to companies to do this. Parents are concerned about this and the sector is concerned about this. There have been overwhelming calls to ensure that smaller not‑for‑profits are sustained, that fees are reduced, that accountability and transparency are provided and that there be a move away from rather than a move towards unfair and unreasonable tender processes that mean small, not‑for‑profit providers can never be competitive against the major businesses and companies that are putting in tender submissions.

This is happening all over the State, including in the Newtown electorate at Stanmore Public School with the council-run service. Other not-for-profit services in other electorates such as the Rainbow Activity Centre in Randwick have been knocked out of the tender process by larger organisations. Fees have increased and as a result there has been a shift in the pressures put on parents, principals and school communities. The experience of parents at one of our local schools, Stanmore Public School, is an example of the way this process is simply allowing companies with little or no experience or expertise in the area to seek profits in this sector. One parent who wrote to us recently about the situation at Stanmore Public School said:

This is a private for profit company, which could of course, increase their rates at any time in the 5 years of this contract. They could be bought by another provider and increase rates as for profit companies do. At this stage we do not have any recourse if the owners and directors of this company decide to sell to a multinational or another for profit company.

…

The two Directors are Secretaries of the company, and their registered address is in the city … They do not list any childcare or children's services as their area of expertise.

The parents are very concerned about this decision to privatise a service, which is of a high standard, and appreciated and trusted by us.

…

Of course privatization then moves the entire services to the Children's Services Award, which is much lower than Council rates of pay and conditions.

This reduces the pay and conditions of the workers in those centres. Numerous firsthand accounts are on the Community Early Learning Australia website regarding issues around this privatisation agenda. We need to move to a model of universal and freely accessible early learning and child care as well as before- and after-school care for all in our community, not based on a for-profit model or the ability of someone to pay.

Mr JAMES GRIFFIN (Manly) (17:34):

:20 In reply: At times this was a meaningful and useful debate and some great personal perspectives were given by members, especially the member for Wallsend. I am pleased that this debate gave her her first opportunity in some eight years to contribute to debate about early childhood learning. I thank her genuinely for raising her concerns about workforce participation in early childhood. Equally I thank the member for North Shore for bringing to the debate her personal experience with her daughter Eleanor. I also thank the member for Upper Hunter, who is a grandfather. Those opposite will not be surprised to learn that his grandchildren call him Grumps.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! If members want to join the member for Kiama, I can make it happen.

Mr JAMES GRIFFIN:

The debate then went off the rails.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

Order! No-one wants to join the member for Kiama.

Mr JAMES GRIFFIN:

That is when this public interest debate got a bit weird. We heard the contribution of the member for Shellharbour, who seemingly asked us to be proud of our contribution. The Minister for Families, Communities and Disability Services interjected and quickly disappeared from the Chamber. The facts are important. The facts are that more than 7,500 before- and after-school-care places have been delivered in New South Wales since 2019. In addition, the Government has grown the before- and after‑school-care sector by an additional 68 services, with seven schools in focus areas of Sydney, Newcastle, Illawarra and the Central Coast, as well as major regional centres. I commend this outstanding motion as read. It notes the terrific commitment and contribution that this Government has made to expanding and increasing early learning and before- and after-school care.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

The member for Manly has moved a motion, to which the member for Charlestown has moved an amendment. The question is that the amendment be agreed to.

The House divided.

Ayes40

Noes44

Majority4

Amendment negatived.

The ASSISTANT SPEAKER:

The question is that the motion be agreed to.

Motion agreed to.