Get Involved - Parliament

Voice to Parliament

Published on: May 2023

Record: HANSARD-1323879322-130758

Voice to Parliament

Mr DAVID HARRIS (WyongMinister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty, Minister for Gaming and Racing, Minister for Veterans, Minister for Medical Research, and Minister for the Central Coast) (17:00:40):

— I move:

That this House:

(1)Supports the Federal Indigenous Voice to Parliament.

I stand in this place today as the Minister for Aboriginal affairs and, importantly, the very first New South Wales Minister for treaty. I stand on the shoulders of giants. My Labor predecessor was the Hon. Linda Burney, MP, who is the current Federal Minister for Indigenous Australians and who was the former member for Canterbury, the former New South Wales shadow Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, the first Aboriginal member of New South Wales Parliament as well as the first Aboriginal Minister in New South Wales. I acknowledge the work of Linda and many others over the years for truth‑telling, reconciliation and partnership between Indigenous and non‑Indigenous Australians.

Today I call members' attention to a significant historic opportunity occurring later this year for the Australian people: a Federal referendum that will ask us to enshrine a First Nations Voice to Federal Parliament in our Constitution. This opportunity has been the result of decades of work by Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities, culminating in the historic Uluru Statement from the Heart in May 2017. That statement was a generous gift to the Australian people—a gift for all of us to walk hand in hand as equals and embrace our shared history, however dark it may be, as a truly reconciled people. The Uluru statement asked:

We seek constitutional reforms to empower our people and take a rightful place in our own country. When we have power over our destiny our children will flourish. They will walk in two worlds and their culture will be a gift to their country.

The referendum is a significant opportunity to unite the country and finally recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people as Australia's First Peoples in the Constitution. The statement asked for "Voice, treaty, truth", and only through having a Voice to Parliament will the other components of treaty and truth‑telling be possible. The wording that we have put to the Australian people is simple but powerful. It asks to include into the Constitution:

1. There shall be a body, to be called the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice;

2. The Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice may make representations to the Parliament and the Executive Government of the Commonwealth on matters relating to Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples;

3. The Parliament shall, subject to this Constitution, have power to make laws with respect to matters relating to the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice, including its composition, functions, powers and procedures.

The Labor Party supports the self-determination of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities and organisations. In New South Wales we have already made a commitment to begin the process of treaty with Indigenous communities after the Voice referendum has been conducted. Labor has committed $5 million to a 12‑month consultation process with First Nations communities on a treaty process for New South Wales. We also welcome and will honour the previous Government's support for, and commitment to, the Partnership Agreement on Closing the Gap.

When Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people have a say in the design and delivery of policies, programs and services, better outcomes are possible for all. However, that is only possible if Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people are acknowledged in the founding document of our nation and if structures are put in place that are protected by the Constitution to ensure First Nations people have a say in the matters that affect them. In order for governments across Australia to support self-determination not just in theory but in actual practice, and in order to support the processes of treaty‑making and truth‑telling that are needed if we are to become a truly reconciled nation, we need a Voice to Parliament. As the New South Wales Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty I support the Voice to Parliament campaign and I personally will be voting "yes" later this year to recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples in our Constitution. I implore all members of this place, including the Opposition and crossbench, to support this historic opportunity.

I note that many members on the other side of the Chamber do support a Voice at the Federal level through the referendum. I acknowledge those members. The motion is in no way a reflection on them, but it is a great opportunity to get unanimous support in this place. That sends an important message to our State on how the Parliament of New South Wales feels about this issue and it gives people direction and support for a yes vote. Today in question time I highlighted the fact that former Premier Dominic Perrottet made a very public statement in support of the Voice, locking the then New South Wales Government into a position of supporting the yes vote. It was unfortunate that in a radio interview the new Opposition leader seemed to water down that support, so today is a great opportunity for every member in this place to vote in support of this motion in a bipartisan way and show great leadership on the issue.

I know that members on this side of the House—and, I am sure, members on the other side of the House and on the crossbench—are meeting with their communities and having discussions about the Voice. They are seeking to answer the important questions that community members are asking. Unfortunately, some of the information that needs to be given out is necessary to counter some of the negative arguments that the Federal Opposition is engaging with. It is great that in New South Wales, as far as I am aware, no State members of Parliament have given support to some of those divisive comments saying that, if the Voice goes ahead, it will create a racist nation and division and those sorts of things. This whole process was designed to bring people together. Aboriginal people reached out and said that we need to walk together in partnership. I implore everyone to support the motion.

Mrs LESLIE WILLIAMS (Port Macquarie) (17:07:49):

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. This is the first time that I have had the opportunity to congratulate you on your elevation to Deputy Speaker. I also take this opportunity to thank the Minister for bringing this issue to the public interest debate, and I congratulate him on his elevation to Minister. Obviously when I was the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, he was the shadow Minister; now we have reversed roles. But I think we can say fairly that we had a great working relationship and I am really excited and feel privileged to be able to continue that relationship in the months ahead. Of course, we were often at events, listening together, which I will talk about further in a minute.

As we head into National Reconciliation Week and National Sorry Day, I know that we will be together to meet with people that I consider my friends now, the Kinchela boys, who have an amazing story to tell. That will be a great way to end this week. As has been pointed out, late this year Australians will have their say on a referendum about whether or not we change the Constitution to recognise First Peoples of Australia by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice. The plan is that the Voice would be an independent and permanent advisory body and that it would give advice to the Australian Parliament and Government on matters that affect the lives of our Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples. As has been outlined by the Minister, on referendum day voters will be asked to vote yes or no on a single question. Subject to the Parliament's approval, the question on the ballot paper will be:

A Proposed Law: to alter the Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice.

Do you approve this proposed alteration?

It calls for a simple yes or no answer. By definition, a referendum is a vote in which all the people in a country, in this case Australia, are asked to give their opinion about or decide on an important political or social question. As indicated by the Leader of the Opposition, it is appropriate that individual members make their own decisions as citizens of Australia regarding the Voice to Parliament. I am confident it will come as no surprise to anyone in this House that I am a strong supporter of the Voice to Parliament, because I believe that the Voice will be incredibly empowering not only for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people but for all of us as Australians. It will encourage inclusivity and respectfulness and will be so important on our path to reconciliation.

However, I acknowledge that not all Australians will agree with me and with a lot of other people in this House. Not everyone who resides in the State of New South Wales will agree and mark yes on the ballot. In fact, not everyone in my electorate will have the same view. I recognise and acknowledge that, but I am very clear in my own mind about my view. I look forward to talking to as many people as I can across my electorate to encourage them to think carefully about and understand the significance of this question for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people.

Unfinished Business

All members in this place can agree that in order to see real change in outcomes for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people—our First Nations people—we must listen to them. That is the first thing we did when we came into government in 2011, and I acknowledge the first Minister for the Coalition, Victor Dominello. He immediately set up a ministerial task force and he listened, which led to the development of a plan with which the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty is familiar. That plan is OCHRE, which stands for Opportunity, Choice, Healing, Responsibility and Empowerment. It is an incredibly important document, but the most important thing about it was that it was developed with Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people. Over 2,700 people contributed to the task force's work in developing the OCHRE plan. Of course, we also responded to , a very important committee report from the Parliament in relation to the reparations scheme. Once again, I thank the Minister for bringing this public interest debate to the House. I am pleased to make a contribution.

Ms TRISH DOYLE (Blue Mountains) (17:12:42):

It is fantastic to follow both the Minister and shadow Minister on this important topic today. I make a contribution on a matter of critical importance to New South Wales and Australia, the Voice to Parliament. The Voice to Parliament referendum, which we need to spend some time explaining amongst our communities, will be held later this year. It will be a vote for a change in our Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia and to provide a structural mechanism through which they can have a voice, quite literally, and be heard by the Australian Government and people.

I personally support the Voice to Parliament, and I support a change to our nation's Constitution. It is important to note for the record that for far too long Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people have been excluded from decisions that directly affect them, their families, their communities and their futures. The Voice to Parliament is an opportunity for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people to have a say in those decisions. As part of my contribution, I will provide a couple of quotes for the record. Marcia Langton said:

The politicians who know and understand the Indigenous residents of their electorates know that the voice makes sense and that it is the singular fix to decades of appalling Indigenous policy and appalling government inaction that has, by and large, worsened the outcomes for our people.

Professor Marcia Langton is one of the most experienced members of the Indigenous Voice to Parliament working group, and I find her voice central to my understanding. Following the Uluru Convention in 2017, Thomas Mayor carried the sacred canvas of the Uluru Statement from the Heart and embarked on an 18-month journey around the country to build support for a constitutionally enshrined First Nations Voice and a Makarrata Commission for truth telling and treaties. Thomas Mayor said:

I transferred that advocacy for my own people and it helped me to see this great deficiency in our advocacy was that we have been purposely divided and lacking a structure from which to practice unity … My inspiration in supporting the Uluru Statement and referendum, is the knowledge of the history of First Nations struggle and the history of representative bodies that have been silenced, and statements and petitions that have been ignored. If you understand structure and unity, you see the importance for us to seek a constitutionally enshrined voice.

Finding the Heart of the Nation: The Journey of the Uluru Statement towards Voice, Treaty and Truth

Thomas Mayor is the author of . I encourage everyone to read that and to encourage others to do so as well. I honour and pay my respects to those two incredible humans, Marcia Langton and Thomas Mayor, whose voices have already made changes for a better Australia.

The NSW Labor Government is in full support of a Voice in our nation's Constitution. We now need political leaders and representatives from all sides of politics to come together with their communities and support the Voice. Only through the Voice to Parliament and the implementation of the Uluru Statement in full can we have a fairer, more just future for all Australians. I thank my colleague the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty for bringing this important public interest debate to the House. It is a respectful debate and it is important to have this conversation. I am sure many members, like me, still have a number of people in our communities who do not quite understand all of those points of concern and confusion. Respectfully sharing those voices amongst us will work towards the change we need. I commend the motion.

Mr JAMES GRIFFIN (Manly) (17:17:14):

In making a contribution to this debate, I also offer my congratulations to the Minister, who is a good man and will do a good job. This Anzac Day I shared a different kind of story from my community, the story of World War I veteran Private Albert Knight. Private Knight was an Aboriginal man and in 1918 was awarded the Distinguished Conduct Medal for great gallantry and devotion to duty in an attack on the village of Bony in France. During a visit last year to Toorale, 160 kilometres south‑west of Bourke, I learned about Private Albert Knight. A Barkandji man, he was born in 1894 on the station in Toorale National Park. Whilst fighting for Australia, he was not recognised as a citizen. Despite being denied the most basic rights, like many other Aboriginal men, Albert and his two brothers enlisted to defend our country. Only during his time of service did Albert find himself free from the discrimination of his everyday civilian life; only while he had the uniform on did he receive equal pay.

Aboriginal people have served in every conflict and commitment involving Australian defence contingents since Federation, including both World Wars and the intervals of peace since the Second World War. Over that time, Aboriginal veterans have won numerous decorations for gallantry in the field, not least being four Distinguished Conduct Medals and 26 Military Medals. If that does not earn one a spot in our Constitution then I do not know what does. I have had the privilege to have worked with Aboriginal people in remote communities right throughout New South Wales. Critics of the Voice say it is ineffective because it is symbolic; yet it became clear to me during my time as Minister that symbolism does create important practical change. Symbolism creates franchise and franchise builds participation and self-determination.

Let me give an example: Deep in far north-west of New South Wales is a historic place called Billagoe, or Mount Drysdale. The site is a multilayered cultural landscape with shared Aboriginal, mining, pastoral and Chinese history. After a 20-year campaign by the local community, I listed it on the New South Wales State Heritage Register and declared it an Aboriginal Place in February 2022. In fact it was my first listing as New South Wales heritage Minister. It was at this place, 34 kilometres north of Cobar, on the historic Kidman Way, that Ngiyampaa Elder Aunty Elaine explained that the recognition created by the listing was an important step in reconciliation. It repaired the disconnect her mob had felt from their land for over a century and was important recognition that built confidence and capacity for her people to deal with more practical challenges.

The heritage listing strengthened the rights of her people to manage the site and allowed the repatriation of Aboriginal objects and remains. Declaring an Aboriginal Place listing, like constitutional recognition of First Nations people, is symbolic and does not bring an immediate resolution to issues confronting Aboriginal people; but that is no good reason to not do it, either. As environment Minister, I set out a proposal to develop a new model for Aboriginal joint management of the entire national parks estate. During the process of consultation it was clear that, like in most areas of society, rarely is there a homogenous view. Different Aboriginal communities have different perspectives of what works best in their local community and so divergent views on the Voice should not be used as a disqualifier for it to proceed. One message I took loud and clear from every Aboriginal community I met with was the value of recognition and listening—to inform practical policy development—and this is what the Voice is about.

The next chapter of Australia should be written with courage, optimism and respect. It can be written with the same courage possessed by Private Albert Knight on the Somme battlefield in May 1918. In having a respectful debate about the Voice, we must not lose sight of our shared goal of doing better by Aboriginal Australians. There can be no doubt that every Australian will make history with their vote at this referendum. How they do that is up to them. But it is one thing to recognise 65,000 years of Aboriginal connection to this vast land; it is another thing to create a Voice that will help Aboriginal people thrive. It is time to do both.

Ms LIESL TESCH (Gosford) (17:22:00):

The Voice referendum will ask a very simple question: Should we amend the Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia and establish an Aboriginal-Islander Voice to Parliament? I support the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty.

Mr David Mehan:

Hear, hear!

Ms LIESL TESCH:

Hear, hear! I congratulate the Minister and everybody in the Parliament. It is really heartening to know that every member so far in the Parliament has spoken in support of the Voice. The Voice to Parliament is about making real and practical change and creating a direct line of advocacy and advisory communication between government and Indigenous Australians that recognises that real changes come only when real community voices are heard. This is about putting Aboriginal people, their wisdom and their knowledge at the table. It is about giving a Voice to Parliament to the oldest living culture in the world and ensuring that all of us continue to walk side by side. This is what Aboriginal people have asked for and later this year this is what we will have the opportunity to do.

I am proud to live in a nation with over 65,000 years of rich Indigenous culture, history, spirits and ancestors, with an incredible deep connection to country that a lot of us will never, ever begin to understand. At the same time I am ashamed to live in a nation where the gap between outcomes for Indigenous and non‑Indigenous Australians in diverse areas such as education, life expectancy and employment continues to grow. If we continue along the same policy pathway we have always taken, we will continue to fail Indigenous Australians. The answers lie with Indigenous people and within Indigenous communities, and they need to be at the table when we make decisions about our Aboriginal brothers and sisters.

Effective change comes when we allow our community voices to be heard. It is time that our Constitution and policymaking reflect this process. This is the opportunity to unite and share a process that is designed to bring us together and to really put us side-by-side at the table. I feel so privileged to be a member of the New South Wales Government because our position is very clear: We support the Voice, we support treaty, and we support truth‑telling. Dominic Perrottet supported the Voice and, looking at the other side of the Parliament, I am confident we have a lot of supporters in this House. As the member for Blue Mountains stated, we have a responsibility to talk and try our best to educate our communities about the Voice and what it is about. We have a lot of messages coming out of the Federal Parliament saying "No", but we as a community have the opportunity to really change our State and change our nation.

As Dr Gordon Reid, who is a Wiradjuri man, a GP and the member for Robertson, said, "If you are happy with the life expectancy of our Aboriginal brothers and sisters, vote no; if you are happy with educational outcomes, vote no; if you are happy with the number of Aboriginal kids in out-of-home care, vote no; if you are happy with Aboriginal health outcomes, vote no; if you are happy with the overrepresentation of Aboriginal people in our prisons system, vote no; if you are happy with employment outcomes, vote no." But I sincerely ask all members of the Opposition, who are teetering on the edge, to be brave and true to themselves, and vote yes for a better future for all of us.

Recently I had the privilege of being part of a Voice to Parliament information session in my community. It was absolutely wonderful to have Dr Gordon Reid and a young Wiradjuri man, Jacob Smeaton, talk to the community. Over 100 people turned up who wanted to find out about the Voice. Most people in the room left with a pretty positive understanding and lots of good information. I acknowledge the presence in the House of the member for Wagga Wagga, Dr Joe McGirr, and the member for The Entrance. While we have been hit hard by the impact of colonisation, we have a strong and growing Aboriginal community and we have the Brain Alliance, consisting of seven Aboriginal organisations across our community who work with and for Aboriginal people. It is so important to make sure that they are absolutely part of our community at every single decision-making process that affects Aboriginal people. I acknowledge Bara Barang; the Darkinjung Local Aboriginal Land Council; Gudjagang Ngara; Mingaletta; NAISDA; The Glen, which is now for men and women; and the Yerin Eleanor Duncan Aboriginal Health Services.

I also make the point that this is for our Aboriginal friends. The member for Manly spoke about stories out in the west, but I have deep friendships with Aboriginal people who want a better outcome for themselves, their families and their community. We have a commitment to make change. After 122 years of our Constitution we have the opportunity to recognise the First Nation people. Let's go for it!

The DEPUTY SPEAKER (Ms Sonia Hornery):

Before I call the member for Sydney, I make members aware that in the Public Interest Debate, we have three Government members, three Opposition members—and it does not exactly matter in which order it is—a member of the crossbench, and then a reply.

Mr ALEX GREENWICH (Sydney) (17:27):

I support this important Public Interest Debate and thank the Minister for bringing it to this House and congratulate him on his appointment to his important role at this important time. Australia is fortunate to have one of the oldest living civilisations in the world, one that is rich in culture, with over 250 languages, unique traditions, magnificent art and an inspiring spiritual connection to country and nature. The Sydney electorate is within the Eora nation of the Gadigal people. We have strong communities of Aboriginal people throughout, but especially in Woolloomooloo and Pyrmont. As Australia matures and embraces its Aboriginal culture, closing the gap of Indigenous disadvantage caused by over two centuries of dispossession and racism must be a priority.

Health, mental health, education, justice, out‑of‑home care, housing and employment outcomes still fall short of a truly equal society. We urgently need culturally sensitive policies and strong investment. But we will only move forward if we work in partnership with Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people, communities and organisations. A shift to a more collaborative approach with self-determination at the forefront is vital to progress and is what Aboriginal people have said will eliminate disadvantage, through the Uluru Statement from the Heart. The May 2017 First Nations National Constitutional Convention established the Uluru Statement from the Heart. The statement affirms sovereignty and the longstanding connection Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people have with land and sea, while calling for a representative Voice to Parliament, a treaty—or Makarrata—through a Makarrata commission and recognition of Indigenous people in our Constitution.

I welcome the Federal Government's process of initiating a referendum for an Indigenous Voice to Parliament. A constitutionally entrenched Indigenous voice will firmly redress the history of poor or non-existent consultation and dialogue with First Nations communities. All levels of government can take action. It is so important that this Parliament is sending this message so early on in this term. I also acknowledge the work of the Federal member for Wentworth, Allegra Spender, on her campaign "Wentworth for the Voice". The City of Sydney, under the leadership of Lord Mayor Clover Moore, will also show its support through a "yes" campaign, as it did during the marriage equality plebiscite.

I am confident that Australia will vote "yes", but supportive community campaigns and a strong result will make it even more uniting. As someone who has led a campaign on a national vote, I know it can be difficult and challenging. But, ultimately, it can and will unite us and reaffirm our national values of respect, fairness and equality, which was what happened when the final legislation for marriage equality went through. Of course, the frustrating thing is that we did not need a public vote to achieve marriage equality, yet the former Federal Coalition imposed one on us. For many LGBTQI+ people, that makes the Federal Coalition's opposition to the referendum required to achieve constitutional recognition for a Voice to Parliament even more frustrating.

The Voice to Parliament is a vital step towards reconciliation. I have no doubt that the vote will be the most consequential vote I will make in my lifetime. Of course, more action is needed towards reconciliation. I also welcome the Minns Government's commitment to consulting on a treaty process, which is also long overdue. I commend the motion to the House.

The DEPUTY SPEAKER (Ms Sonia Hornery):

I welcome the visitors in the gallery.

Ms FELICITY WILSON (North Shore) (17:31:52):

I contribute to the public interest debate brought to the House by the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty. I recognise and thank the Minister for bringing this discussion to the House today. It is a matter that is facing people across our country, and it is very important for us to consider in our daily lives, including in this place. I thank, recognise and congratulate him on that point. I also recognise that the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty and the shadow Minister for Aboriginal Affairs have fought to ensure representation, justice and access for Indigenous peoples across our State as we move even further towards reconciliation. I am confident that they will work together, as I know the current Minister did while he was in opposition, to ensure that we seek outcomes for these communities.

Members in this place know that we have made significant strides toward reconciliation. In my six years in this place, a range of different steps have been taken. That does not mean that we should stop that journey. There is a lot more work to be done. But, when it comes to the Voice and to this discussion about ensuring that Indigenous peoples have a Voice in our Federal Parliament—and obviously there will be discussions, for instance, about how that is enacted within State jurisdictions as well—it is incredibly important for us to ensure that we are driven by the views and representation of Indigenous peoples, first and foremost.

I live, work and spend my days walking on Cammeraygal country. Cammeraygal country is probably best known for its most iconic daughter, Barangaroo. When one thinks about Cammeraygal country, across the harbour in North Sydney and through to Mosman, it is an incredibly iconic place. Now it is built up. It is one of the densest places in Australia for built environment. But when one thinks back to the natural environment over the 65,000‑plus years that preceded colonial settlement in Australia, one can just imagine what that would have looked like: the harbour foreshore, the bushland, the native environment, the types of flora and fauna that existed. I think about the care, respect and appreciation that the Cammeraygal people provided to the land that I now get to call home—that I get to raise my children on. I thank them for that custodianship of country, of the land, the water, the sea and the sky. We now draw so much value every single day as we walk on that country.

But we cannot just recognise that contribution of custodianship. Very few people of Cammeraygal descent remain alive because of how incredibly effective the eradication of Indigenous people has been during colonisation. We cannot walk away from that. Many languages, tribes and bloodlines have been lost. We cannot change that history, but we can change the future. As the member for Manly said, we can change it through both symbolic statements and practical policies.

Symbolic statements do matter. The Uluru Statement from the Heart and the culmination of work done has led to significant support, particularly within my own community of North Shore, for an Indigenous Voice to Parliament. The Uluru Statement from the Heart, as members know, was created after the referendum council led a series of regional dialogues with First Nations people from all corners of the country to ensure local voices were heard. It ended with a convention that endorsed the work of the dialogues and issued the Uluru Statement from the Heart to the Australian people. The first question is whether we want to listen to the Uluru Statement from the Heart and take it on board. The second question is whether we want to say "yes" to a First Nations Voice enshrined in the constitution. I quote from the Uluru Statement from the Heart because it is most powerful to use their words and not mine. They say:

Proportionally, we are the most incarcerated people on the planet. We are not an innately criminal people. Our children are aliened from their families at unprecedented rates. This cannot be because we have no love for them. And our youth languish in detention in obscene numbers. They should be our hope for the future.

the torment of our powerlessness

These dimensions of our crisis tell plainly the structural nature of our problem. This is .

a rightful place

We seek constitutional reforms to empower our people and take in our own country. When we have power over our destiny our children will flourish. They will walk in two worlds and their culture will be a gift to their country.

I do not know who could say no to such a powerful statement for self-determination and for the future of Indigenous children to walk alongside all other children in our country.

Dr JOE McGIRR (Wagga Wagga) (17:37:10):

By leave: I make a brief contribution in support of the motion. I congratulate the Minister on bringing the motion and on his appointment. I begin by acknowledging the traditional custodians of the lands on which I live, the Wiradjuri people. I pay my respects to Elders past, present and emerging. I also acknowledge that I am not speaking for them. I am making a brief contribution to this debate, but I am not in any way wishing to subvert their right to make their own contribution about their own affairs.

The situation of First Nations people in this country is absolutely unique. They were the custodians of the land when Europeans arrived—the oldest continuous culture on this planet, for at least 65,000 years. Since colonisation, of course, they have been grievously afflicted. Despite all best efforts, our attempts to rectify that situation have, to this day, been inadequate. The member for Gosford outlined many of the areas of inadequacy in her speech, but the fact that 43 per cent of children in out-of-home care are still from Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander backgrounds is an instance where we have done nothing, in a sense, to manage the Stolen Generation and improve that situation. That is the situation; that is the context. The question, then, is what would a Voice to Parliament do to help that situation? I believe it is an important step and I support the motion.

While speaking in support, I address three objections to the Voice. People say to me, "Well, it is just symbolic." They say, "It won't make a difference." They ask, "Why do we need to put it in the constitution?" I will address those three objections and turn them around in a positive way. First of all, Indigenous people were the custodians of the land when we arrived. We have previously believed that they should have constitutional recognition. I think this is the way to do it—to enshrine a Voice in the constitution. It is not just symbolic; it will be practical.

The second point is that people say to me, "Why? It will just be a symbol. This will just be symbolic." To that, I say that symbols are important. There would not be a religious community in this country that does not have symbols that are fundamental to it. The welcome to country has been an important part of our civic life for the past 20 years, and I believe it has changed our attitudes. There would not be a football code in this country that does not compete for a premiership trophy. They do not win that trophy so that they have something to drink out of; they win it because it is a symbol. Symbols are important. They change our lives. Let us not ever debase the value of symbols. The Voice is a powerful symbol, but it is also practical.

Why do I say that? I have worked in the bureaucracy for many years, and I am now part of the democratic process that tries to keep bureaucracy accountable. The bureaucracy of government is well‑meaning and often very effective, but it does not operate at its best unless it has democratic oversight. That is a simple fact. For all the well-meaning nature of bureaucrats, at the end of the day it is this institution and the institutions of democracy that keep bureaucracy accountable. Sadly, some of the lack of outcomes we have had in attempting to address the issues of our First Nations people come from the fact that they do not have democratic input into the bureaucracy that is attempting to solve their issues. I believe that a Voice to Parliament will provide that democratic accountability; after all, it is why we are here. One of the great things about our society is that we hold bureaucracy to account. Our First Nations people do not have that authority and power yet, and a Voice to Parliament will provide that to them. It will enable our bureaucracy to be its best self in addressing the issues of First Nations people.

I note that this Friday 26 May is National Sorry Day, and I am truly honoured to be able to say a few words at the Wagga Wagga National Sorry Day event at the Sorry Day Rock on Wiradjuri land. The Stolen Generation is one of the terrible examples of what happens when government does not listen and when bureaucracy imposes its own will and agenda on First Nations people. I support the motion because I support the importance of symbols and the importance of bureaucracy and democratic accountability. The Voice will go a long way to addressing the issues of First Nations people.

Mr DAVID HARRIS (WyongMinister for Aboriginal Affairs and Treaty, Minister for Gaming and Racing, Minister for Veterans, Minister for Medical Research, and Minister for the Central Coast) (17:41:35):

— In reply: I thank my friend the member for Port Macquarie. I am excited to have her as the shadow Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and look forward to working with her. The member for Port Macquarie made some significant reforms in her time as Minister, and she can be very proud of that work. If I can be half as good as her, I will be happy. I also acknowledge the member for Blue Mountains, who I know is very passionate about Aboriginal issues, as well as the member for Gosford. The member for Manly, who I do not think is still in the Chamber, gave a great speech. I thank him for that. I also acknowledge his recognition of veterans, which is one of my other portfolios, and acknowledge that this Friday is the Indigenous soldier commemoration at Hyde Park, which is an important event.

The member for Sydney, as always, is a uniting figure. This place is a lot better for his presence, given some of the major reform that has been achieved through his ability to bring people together, even on difficult issues. The member for North Shore passionately talked about her area and gave proper recognition that we all quite often walk through our own country and do not necessarily realise what has happened before. I thank her for raising that. I thank the member for Wagga Wagga, who is a great person to have in this place. Some big conversations with members of the crossbench are coming up on a range of issues, and I know that we can work in a positive capacity. For the benefit of the House, I seek leave to table a letter from the Attorney-General of Australia, Mark Dreyfus. It is his submission to the inquiry into the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice Referendum, which is submission 64. It gives the legal opinion about how it is constitutionally okay to vote yes. He makes some interesting comments in the document quoting the Solicitor‑General.

Leave granted.

Document tabled.

Mr DAVID HARRIS:

I finish by saying that this is a better place when we have respectful debates about important issues that affect our communities. Everyone has agreed with each other today, which is not always the case in this place, but we are all better when we are united on these issues.

The SPEAKER:

The question is that the motion be agreed to.

Division called for.

The SPEAKER:

I ask the member for Rockdale, being the person who called the division, to move to the other side of the Chamber. As the member who called the division for the noes, he cannot then vote with the ayes. It is an unfortunate situation. Under Standing Order 175, the member for Rockdale is not permitted to vote with the ayes. The standing orders require that two tellers for the ayes and two tellers for the noes be appointed. Because there are not two tellers for the noes, the division will not proceed.

Division called off.

Motion agreed to.